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> Teaching "go Sniff" Behaviour
Jenny.Wren
post 26th Mar 2012, 7:43 am
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ok, another week............ I'm exhausted from being so upset all weekend sad.gif

As you can appreciated I've been a little bit overwhelmed with everything and there has been lots of helpful advice so i've been re-reading the posts and trying to work on one thing as trying many different things is going to send me wacko.gif

So for now I'm going to keep Ellie on a shorter lead, and h/c when necessary. I'm going to keep her close to me and rewarding her for staying "close" - which she is getting better at with click/treat. (Karen - she will work with a regular clicker now). For example, it was dark again this morning so we spent an hour street walking and I stopped at a small car park, tied up Sam and did some follow me, close, wait and there was a bench so I asked for "on" and off" which she responded to smile.gif Obviously being dark there were no birds to stalk so trying this method this afternoon may be a different story.

Now from what I've read, as well as keeping her "close", I should then let her have sniff/mooching time with a cue word. thing is when I do this, she then will pull me ahead - as she does when on a long line - because she wants to lead the way and doesn't really sniff/mooch about. How can I encourage her to sniff and not want to pull ahead? Should I switch directions and repeat the cue? Also is "go sniff" a good cue?

Maybe some time out with just walking and not having the freedom to chase will settle her a bit.

Also this morning for breakfast, I fed her by hand and asked for sit or watch

This post has been edited by Jenny.Wren: 26th Mar 2012, 7:44 am
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kittypimms
post 26th Mar 2012, 7:56 am
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Sounds like good progress! ok.gif

A couple of threads that may help (one of them mine from earlier in the winter!)

http://www.dogpages.org.uk/forums/index.ph...l=sniff+pulling

http://www.dogpages.org.uk/forums/index.ph...l=sniff+pulling

I use "Go sniff" as FDog's release. He's still not great (because I'm not consistent enough!!) but he's getting better smile.gif

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Jenny.Wren
post 26th Mar 2012, 8:02 am
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thanks amy. Are you still lobbing sausages? lol.gif

Ellie does understand "find it", when I scatter food. I wonder if I should do this first but I'm worried I'm going to confuse her if I start adding "go sniff".
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dogaholic
post 26th Mar 2012, 4:00 pm
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Hi there,

I have read all your topics on Ellie with interest, as she sounds like she has some of the same issues my lurcher had (has), although not entirely the same. I taught him "go sniff" in two contexts.

Firstly indoors, at training classes, if he was getting bored and might have started barking or reacting I would sprinkle teeny tiny bits of sausage around my feet and tell him to go sniff.

Secondly, I used Premack around rabbit holes. I know this sounds insane, but he when we moved here we suddently had millions of rabbit holes just outside our front door, and there was no getting through to him, he once evaded me for 40 mins dodging from hole to hole - yes I understand the feeling of being frustrated to tears with a predatory dog (fortunately we are well off the road here). I then found Control Unleashed, and got some fantastic advice through the email group. I took him out on a lead and we Premacked the rabbit holes. So I would ask for a sit or say his name (which means he has to look at me) and his reward would be "good boy" *sausage* "go sniff". It took a while, but I can now send him to sniff holes, and recall him from holes. smile.gif

I also did a lot of chase recall stuff with toys, which I appreciate you are not able to do just yet. However, one thing you wuld be able to do is work with jackpots. For my boy, a couple of times I took out a bag of tripe (raw) and sometimes I will still take a little tray of Cesar or something like that hidden in a pocket, and jackpot a really good response. It can be a response to anything, I think the first time I jackpotted a head turn away from a barking dog (he has fear issues with dogs too).

I think you are doing brilliantly with Ellie, it is not easy. flowers.gif
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Lindsay
post 27th Mar 2012, 7:31 am
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Just to clarify, are we talking about the difference between her being on a shorter lead/heelwork/loose lead work (not sniffing/mooching, but still under control) and the other thing where the dog is still on lead but can relax, not pay so much attention to owner, and do what they want, within reason?

With Banya, I'd have her on a long lead (the Company of Animals one) and harness, and she'd be say walking "nicely" as I'd have previously asked her to do. So paying attention, or at least walking on a loose lead and quite close to me, not more than a couple of feet ahead at any time.

Then I'd use a release word, the one I always use, which for us is "ok" and that means "ok you can relax, we are not working/end of what I want you to do/go chill a bit.

I'd accompany that with a foreward movement of the arm (dogs are so good at body language) and then just stand still ... she learnt to sniff and wander to the extent of the long lead, then gradually she realised she could wander ahead, not be under full control but still "mooch" .

Some dogs don't mooch much, but will want to get ahead, my best suggestoin would be to train separately (as otherwise there wil be an elemetn of competitoin from the other dog) and go out prepared to mooch yourself.

You can show the th difference between the two, by every 5 minutes or so calling to a more controlled positoin, and then again after a couple of moments of attentoin/under close control, relax and give the release word and arm movement.

Hth,

Lindsay
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kittypimms
post 27th Mar 2012, 7:58 am
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QUOTE(Jenny.Wren @ 26th Mar 2012, 9:02 am) *

thanks amy. Are you still lobbing sausages? lol.gif

Oh crikey all the time!! lol.gif lol.gif It's the only thing that distracts him from the feast of horse poo on the Common! rolleyes.gif
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Jenny.Wren
post 27th Mar 2012, 8:16 am
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QUOTE(dogaholic @ 26th Mar 2012, 5:00 pm) *

I think you are doing brilliantly with Ellie, it is not easy. flowers.gif


thank you, not it's not easy err.gif What's premack?


QUOTE(Lindsay @ 27th Mar 2012, 8:31 am) *

Just to clarify, are we talking about the difference between her being on a shorter lead/heelwork/loose lead work (not sniffing/mooching, but still under control) and the other thing where the dog is still on lead but can relax, not pay so much attention to owner, and do what they want, within reason?



well she understands close (which to her is by my side) so I say this and click/treat, I suppose it's LLW, as long as she's not pulling then I'm happy using the word close as she understands it. I don't want to start introducing new words and confusing her.

Well this morning I chucked down pasta and said go sniff and I think she was starting to get the hang of it. then when she was sniffing I clicked and treat.
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jackied
post 27th Mar 2012, 8:36 am
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QUOTE
What's premack?


Premack is using something that the dog really wants as the reward, other than a treat or a toy. A life reward.

So for example if Lucy is desperate to go for a walk, her reward for sitting quietly while I put on the lead is simply to go for the walk - no need to give her a treat too. I've often rewarded Twix for a nice 'heel' by then releasing him to go and pee on a bush lol.gif . The trick is to control the dogs access to what it really really wants, and only letting it have it for good behaviour.

Doesn't work for everything, of course. I can't let Lucy hunt my chickens! smile.gif


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Lindsay
post 27th Mar 2012, 9:10 am
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QUOTE(Jenny.Wren @ 27th Mar 2012, 9:16 am) *

thank you, not it's not easy err.gif What's premack?
well she understands close (which to her is by my side) so I say this and click/treat, I suppose it's LLW, as long as she's not pulling then I'm happy using the word close as she understands it. I don't want to start introducing new words and confusing her.


Yes, that is LLW too, same thing, and you are right not to alter the word, that sounds good ok.gif
QUOTE

Well this morning I chucked down pasta and said go sniff and I think she was starting to get the hang of it. then when she was sniffing I clicked and treat.


Sounds good again ok.gif

Lindsay
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Jenny.Wren
post 27th Mar 2012, 9:13 am
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QUOTE(jackied @ 27th Mar 2012, 9:36 am) *

Premack is using something that the dog really wants as the reward, other than a treat or a toy. A life reward.

So for example if Lucy is desperate to go for a walk, her reward for sitting quietly while I put on the lead is simply to go for the walk - no need to give her a treat too. I've often rewarded Twix for a nice 'heel' by then releasing him to go and pee on a bush lol.gif . The trick is to control the dogs access to what it really really wants, and only letting it have it for good behaviour.

Doesn't work for everything, of course. I can't let Lucy hunt my chickens! smile.gif


lol.gif doh! I thought it was a treat - i've been looking on the internet for some premack and thought dogaholic was stuffing premack down the rabbit holes lol.gif

This post has been edited by Jenny.Wren: 27th Mar 2012, 9:16 am
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walkiesandtalkies
post 27th Mar 2012, 9:24 am
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QUOTE(Jenny.Wren @ 27th Mar 2012, 10:13 am) *

lol.gif doh! I thought it was a treat - i've been looking on the internet for some premack and thought dogaholic was stuffing premack down the rabbit holes lol.gif


lol.gif lol.gif was she doing that on a ridgeway type walk lol.gif lol.gif


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Lindsay
post 27th Mar 2012, 9:29 am
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QUOTE(walkiesandtalkies @ 27th Mar 2012, 10:24 am) *

lol.gif lol.gif was she doing that on a ridgeway type walk lol.gif lol.gif


lol.gif tongue.gif lol.gif lol.gif
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dogaholic
post 27th Mar 2012, 10:11 am
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Sorry, but now I am laughing too hard to type! lol.gif

*snort*

Jennywren, at its simplest Premack is best thought of as asking the dog to do something we want, so they get to do what they want. Many people ask their dog to sit for their dinner. But you can take it as far as you want, and for the benefit of my shoulders if I walk my partners two collies I use "you earn the right to get to the field by walking nicely not pulling".

For my hunting dog it has totally changed his perception of rabbit holes that sometimes I send him to sniff them, I sometimes even let him dig out the tunnels (I fill them back in), and sometimes if I find a really good hole I think he has missed I call him over (recall) and we look at it together (reward). unsure.gif

This post has been edited by dogaholic: 27th Mar 2012, 10:11 am
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Jenny.Wren
post 27th Mar 2012, 10:35 am
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QUOTE(walkiesandtalkies @ 27th Mar 2012, 10:24 am) *

lol.gif lol.gif was she doing that on a ridgeway type walk lol.gif lol.gif



QUOTE(Lindsay @ 27th Mar 2012, 10:29 am) *

lol.gif tongue.gif lol.gif lol.gif


yeah, yeah, funny guys tongue.gif
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Jenny.Wren
post 27th Mar 2012, 10:39 am
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QUOTE(dogaholic @ 27th Mar 2012, 11:11 am) *

Sorry, but now I am laughing too hard to type! lol.gif

*snort*

Jennywren, at its simplest Premack is best thought of as asking the dog to do something we want, so they get to do what they want. Many people ask their dog to sit for their dinner. But you can take it as far as you want, and for the benefit of my shoulders if I walk my partners two collies I use "you earn the right to get to the field by walking nicely not pulling".

For my hunting dog it has totally changed his perception of rabbit holes that sometimes I send him to sniff them, I sometimes even let him dig out the tunnels (I fill them back in), and sometimes if I find a really good hole I think he has missed I call him over (recall) and we look at it together (reward). unsure.gif


yes, I'm chuckling now lol.gif I kept thinking "what the hell is premack" ohmy.gif I was getting all sorts coming up on youtube too! I think because you put a capital letter at the front I thought it was the brand of a great treat!

I understand now rolleyes.gif
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