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> The Use Of Halti's & Stop Pull Harnesses, Just a rant
ann2k
post 25th Feb 2012, 7:58 am
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I find it hard to beleive that some people go out to by these Halti's & Sstop Pull Harnesses & still let theirs dogs pull, some people think that by buying these training aids it will work instantly but it is a case of knowing how to use them am i correct or not??

I have given a freind so much advice that it has gone out of the window, so i asked if i could walk her dog she let me & he walked right next to me, & i must admit i did say to her it isnt only the dog that needs to be trained it is also the owners, this particular dog has a harness on & he still walks all over the place she shouts @ him which does make me cross, but it's like talking to a brick wall sometimes where you repeat yourself & nothing is being done about it, he also has has a halti but i tried to explain to teach the dog to walk on one side but she gives him a bit more lead, so i think what's the point!! sry just needed to get it off my chest, but i would like other people's opinions on this one please as to whether or not you agree or disagree with me. smile.gif
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Bunter1
post 25th Feb 2012, 9:31 am
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I don't like the harnesses that tighten up under the armpits err.gif All my dogs wear harnesses, but they have rings at the front or sides.

I also don't like using headcollars for anything other than gently turning a dog's head away. I hate to see them with just a lead on the headcollar as well. So much harm can be done by a dog setting his neck against them, pulling or hitting the end of the lead sad.gif

Harnesses and headcollars are training aids. They can help while you are training your dog to walk to heel, but they don't train it on their own, there has to be human input lol.gif

When I use them, I use a harness and double ended lead, so there are two points of contact. One end of the lead clipped on the back of the harness and the other end either on the collar or the other point of the harness (front or side). If I need to use a headcollar then the lead is on a harness and the headcollar and the headcollar is only brought into play when I need to.

So - in answer to your question lol.gif Yes they do need to be used correctly!
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nikirushka
post 25th Feb 2012, 9:50 am
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As Jo says - any training aid needs human input too!

I was talking to a woman the other day at the field, she's just got a huge lab who pulls like a train - she walks him on a flat collar but can barely hold him, but her OH walks him on a choke chain. Which predictably, he just puts on and the dog still pulls rolleyes.gif

That really does my head in - surely it's pretty ferkin obvious in that situation that IT IS NOT WORKING! I warned her about the physical damage chokes can do (especially when used like that rolleyes.gif) and gave her my card with an offer of testing some of my kit to find something that would help to start with, not heard back though. Can't say I'm surprised really, but I dare say I'll run into her again.

And as for the armpit-pinchers - ARG! The useless trainer round here is obsessed with them. She's one of those 'it worked for one of my dogs therefore it will work for every dog in the world' type people (even though it didn't work on her dog as he still pulled without it), so every single dog she sees that pulls is put on one straight away. Unfortunately I know from first hand experience that dogs can and do learn negative associations with other things from them - Soli 'learned' that other dogs = pain under the armpits so her aggression was 10 times worse on any kind of harness when I got her. Was at least 6 months before she could wear one, longer I think. I've explained this to the trainer in the past, over a year ago, and yet a few weeks back I still had to explain it again and she still doesn't grasp the reasoning behind it. But, she is at least not pushing the armpit-pinchers to aggression clients now - they get referred straight to me and I find something better to suit, if it's needed.

I must confess to a huge feeling of smugness when she showed me her puppy the other day - on a halti harness cos the armpit-pincher didn't work devil.gif

I prefer things with front rings myself - I find a lot of people struggle with using a double-ended lead though, and halti harnesses are rubbish just using the front ring as they ride up and move around way too much. Good idea, bad execution. I've put one client on the premier easy walk (which only has a front ring) and it's been brilliant for his dog and him.

Horses for courses but I see no reason to use anything that causes discomfort - when I get my sewing machine, my guys will be kitted out with homemade harnesses with a front ring, similar to the halti but designed for minimal movement when using that ring only (and no tightening anywhere) so I can have four on lead and not be trying to use double-ended leads.
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ann2k
post 25th Feb 2012, 10:06 am
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thankyou im glad you both agree with the issue that the owner also needs to learn how to use these aids appropiately I actually use a stop pull harness for lola, which has been brillaint, i have always checked her armpits for any sores but thankfully none, she cant wear a collar as they rub & wear her fur away which also made her sore & a for choke chains i detest them!!
Lola dosnt like the head collar & neither do i, although i did teach her not to pull using this, but the harness is great.
Thankyou both for your input & the more i hear also the more im learning, so i can hopefully pass onto others.
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caza61
post 25th Feb 2012, 5:56 pm
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have just had to buy a harness for my cocker ozzy , he has been diagnosed with a crumbling disc in his neck , and the vet has said NOT to put a collar and lead on him anymore, ozzy has allways pulled on the lead ( i think myself this is what has caused the disc problem ). any advice what to do when i start using the harness ?? regarding his pulling rolleyes.gif
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Jazzlet
post 25th Feb 2012, 6:10 pm
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Caza61 start a thread in Training and Behaviour for advice on that smile.gif
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ann2k
post 25th Feb 2012, 6:25 pm
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Im so sorry to hear that cazza61, i did reaf your post earlier then my laptop died, Thinking of you & your dog xxx
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riotous_uk
post 25th Feb 2012, 7:46 pm
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QUOTE(caza61 @ 25th Feb 2012, 5:56 pm) *

have just had to buy a harness for my cocker ozzy , he has been diagnosed with a crumbling disc in his neck , and the vet has said NOT to put a collar and lead on him anymore, ozzy has allways pulled on the lead ( i think myself this is what has caused the disc problem ). any advice what to do when i start using the harness ?? regarding his pulling rolleyes.gif


I've put a lovely video clip in T&B on LLW
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caza61
post 25th Feb 2012, 7:47 pm
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thanks smile.gif
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caza61
post 25th Feb 2012, 7:52 pm
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they make it look so easy err.gif , my dog is 10 is it possible to teach an old dog new things lol.gif
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nikirushka
post 25th Feb 2012, 8:00 pm
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QUOTE(caza61 @ 25th Feb 2012, 7:52 pm) *

they make it look so easy err.gif , my dog is 10 is it possible to teach an old dog new things lol.gif


Of course! I was still teaching my 10yr old things until she left, and my nearly 9yr olds are always up for learning new stuff smile.gif

I'll actually be doing LLW with the 300 peck method with the boy soon as since his thyroid has improved his pulling has returned lol.gif
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caza61
post 25th Feb 2012, 9:00 pm
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well i am going to give it a try lol.gif , he's still on rest at the moment but when he's ready the training starts ohmy.gif
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ann2k
post 26th Feb 2012, 10:18 am
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I taught myself & taught my dog smile.gif
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jumbuck
post 1st Mar 2012, 8:20 am
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Sometimes it is easier to teach an old dog than a puppy as they have a better attention span. lol.gif Agree strongly with the statement made of 'Any training aid needs human input.' Sad to say that some pet shop owners get dog owners to buy equipment that they have on their shelves thinking it will give a quick training fix when they don't even know themselves how to use them. sad.gif
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Seth's Servant
post 1st Mar 2012, 6:13 pm
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Sef needed a halti for about 6 months because he was dragging me into the road after things. But it was used in conjunction with a harness and lots of treats to try and distract him. If he started pulling the harness took the strain. I wouldn't have used it on Sef if, like some dogs I've seen, re-acted against it but he accepted it almost immediately so I was able to get his attention to get him walking properly.
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