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> Puppy Training Classes, What will he have done there?
rynkybrown
post 18th Feb 2012, 7:08 pm
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QUOTE(rosiemongrel @ 18th Feb 2012, 6:50 pm) *

his control position


lol.gif lol.gif Control and Callum lol.gif


wink.gif
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dogwalker123
post 18th Feb 2012, 7:15 pm
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Just had another thought. I always used 'wait' if I was then going to call the dog to me and 'stay' if I was going to return and Coady had to stay where she was, but I know other folks used them the other way around. Perhaps 'wait 'is his command for 'don't move until I come back to you?

Sounds like you need to wait until you think he's ready and reteach.
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woofgang
post 18th Feb 2012, 7:46 pm
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perhaps a toy waggle along with whatever word you use to make clear that recall is fun?
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Dalsmum
post 18th Feb 2012, 7:57 pm
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Do you stand facing him when you call him?

If so, try standing side on or facing away from him- it males you less threatening.

Or call him and move away with a 'come on then' rather than a formal recall. When he catches you up have a game with him.

Or put his dinner down and call him through to get it.

Once he has more confidence you can introduce more formality.
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Gnasher
post 18th Feb 2012, 8:01 pm
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If he is the bright boy he sounds like I would teach him a hand touch then use that rather than come as lots of dogs seem to find that less threatening if they are worried unsure.gif
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rynkybrown
post 18th Feb 2012, 8:36 pm
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QUOTE(dogwalker123 @ 18th Feb 2012, 7:06 pm) *

but she actually responded to the smile of relief I did

I think you are right, he is watching me for all signals all the time. He's not that different to a deaf one unsure.gif
He looks blank when I say goooooooooooood boyyyyyyyyyyyy at the moment though err.gif

QUOTE(dogwalker123 @ 18th Feb 2012, 7:15 pm) *

Just had another thought. I always used 'wait' if I was then going to call the dog to me and 'stay' if I was going to return and Coady had to stay where she was, but I know other folks used them the other way around. Perhaps 'wait 'is his command for 'don't move until I come back to you?

Sounds like you need to wait until you think he's ready and reteach.

Good point.


QUOTE(woofgang @ 18th Feb 2012, 7:46 pm) *

perhaps a toy waggle along with whatever word you use to make clear that recall is fun?

Yes, am going to strap a ragger onto me alongside the treat bag, will help with the mouthing too I think smile.gif


QUOTE(Dalsmum @ 18th Feb 2012, 7:57 pm) *

Do you stand facing him when you call him?

If so, try standing side on or facing away from him- it males you less threatening.

Or call him and move away with a 'come on then' rather than a formal recall. When he catches you up have a game with him.

Or put his dinner down and call him through to get it.

Once he has more confidence you can introduce more formality.


I'm very casual and carry on walking through with him behind me, he just pauses last minute. With the gate, am now saying okay then, when he doesn't want to come, slightly closing it, showing him that I'm just going about my business, then he's wanting to come in (which is straight away) I open it without looking at him and he lollops in wub.gif


QUOTE(Gnasher @ 18th Feb 2012, 8:01 pm) *

If he is the bright boy he sounds like I would teach him a hand touch then use that rather than come as lots of dogs seem to find that less threatening if they are worried unsure.gif


Aha!!
This would really work I think, good idea ok.gif

He's snoring in his crate now, the change in 24hrs had been amazing wub.gif


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Bunter1
post 18th Feb 2012, 8:46 pm
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QUOTE(rynkybrown @ 18th Feb 2012, 8:36 pm) *

He's snoring in his crate now, the change in 24hrs had been amazing wub.gif

yay.gif grin.gif
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Beaky
post 18th Feb 2012, 10:15 pm
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QUOTE(dogwalker123 @ 18th Feb 2012, 7:06 pm) *

The one I thought I was teaching Coady was 'okay'...but she actually responded to the smile of relief I did when I turned and saw that she had done what she was told! In the end I had to remember not to look at her until I actually wanted her to come! I also remember our trainer saying that they were actually hearing 'good girl' as the release command. No help I know but good luck with him.


That's really common and an easy habit to get into. We had to 'break' that with Sash so we started using 'good sit/down/stand' etc instead of 'good girl', just so WE can differentiate. I know there is a lot of discussion about the 'point' to verbal commands for dogs, but if it helps the humans then I'm all for it. This tends to be more agility though where body language is more important than verbal cues.

Oh and I use 'Go!' as a release. It's the only thing I say quite sharply and quickly and can be yelled repeatedly with little breath needed when running at full pelt lol.gif

I've never had a puppy - Sash is the youngest I have had and she was shut down when we adopted her. When she came out of that state her behaviour was so bad she had no puppy behavioural traits other than chewing lol.gif

I have taught puppies now and I was initially stunned at how little attention span they have lol.gif They do learn so quickly though and I had a pretty steep learning curve! Sasha did not, partly because she is thick and partly because of her past behavioural problems I think they created a barrier to her learning effectively. She actually learns more quickly now than she used to (although that could be because I can teach her more effectively).

Puppies are fun but in small doses IME lol.gif
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misty11
post 19th Feb 2012, 10:18 pm
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I had to reteach Ember wait, because she just didn't get it! I now use a different command, novice, and it seems to be slowly working. So maybe just reteach as if it's something new using different commands?
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walkiesandtalkies
post 20th Feb 2012, 8:50 am
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I use Ok as a release cue. He could be worried about breaking the release if he's been taught wait/stay firmly. I know he's bit of a velcro boy and if he was not great at stays because he didn;t weant to be away from his previous mum then sometimes people get much firmer about it rather than breaking it down and he may have got worried about breaking the stay after he's done it. I may be tempted, not to use the flat hand as some doggie find that a bit intimidating and I would also be tempted to use a new word like wait and teach it from scratch in teeny tiny steps, so starting off with just one step away and building up.

I would also try if you need to use the current stay, try crouching down to release him when you call as it will likely encourage him smile.gif


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agilitylace
post 22nd Feb 2012, 10:41 am
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If it were me i would be avoiding all wait / stay situations - these have always been areas of extreme stress with any of my biters that have arrived with previous ''training''. Jack will still bite if a stranger told him to wait ohmy.gif and Kai shuts down completely at the sound of the word.

Wait and stay are often taught very wrongly (people using the word Wait wait WAIT WAAAAIT) long before the behaviour is being offered - this can cause massive stress and anxiety (esp in collies IME - but maybe thats coz i see it so much at agility shows ?)

Kai was re taught wait (3 years after he moved in) to the command 'chipmunks' lol.gif to try to take any stress levels from my body language and to make it much fun

I wouldnt at this stage worry about his release command i would be making sure you dont say the dreaded 'wait' if he does stop by his own accord i would either do the hand touch , ignore him and carry on your business (taking the stress away from doorways) , or throw a toy etc again changing the situation completely.

Tek is very very wary of doorways as i feel they have always been an area he has found un happy - ie, where strange people come from, where he reacts and where he saw the people he loved get stressed with him (even in a nice non punishment way) . So we ignore doorways here and i allow him to go through with about 4 others as if it was open field

hope that helps xx
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Yummy
post 22nd Feb 2012, 11:03 am
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The puppy training class I use teaches a "finish" from a "wait"

Put the dog in a "sit" using whichever hand signal you choose, I put my hand flat with palm facing up wards and flick my wrist upwards so my fingers end up pointing towards the sky. tell the dog to "wait" with the flat hand signal as Beaky described. Walk away, turn around to face the dog. Big open arms (like a starfish) shout the dog's name and say "come". Dog (theoretically) comes to you. Put the dog in a "sit" right in front of you, looking at you. Then say "finish". Dog walks round you on your right side, behind your back and ends up on your left hand side (the heel position). Put the dog in a *sit*.

Sounds long winded but it happens fast and looks beautiful when you get it right lol.gif

When I first start it goes....

put the dog in a sit, put the dog in a sit again, walk away, retrieve dog from wherever it's bogged off to. Put the dog in a sit. step away slowly so you're still only 3cm's away from the dog. Call the dog. retrieve the dog from wherever it's bogged off to. put the dog in a sit. Clip the dog's lead back on and get one of the teachers to stand behind gently holding the lead so dog can't bog off. Tip the wink to the teacher to say you're going to call the dog, call the dog, run round in a Benny Hill style whilst dog is hoovering up any treats it can find and you're trying desperately to grab trailing lead.....

rolleyes.gif maybe I should try a different breed to retrievers who can sniff out a dropped treat at 300 paces lol.gif


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misty11
post 22nd Feb 2012, 2:00 pm
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What you described is called a novice recall. Then there is the 'A' recall which is when you call the dog to heel and carry on walking.

Sorry if you knew that already! but it's easier to say novice recall lol.gif

This post has been edited by misty11: 22nd Feb 2012, 2:02 pm
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woofgang
post 22nd Feb 2012, 2:41 pm
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QUOTE(Yummy @ 22nd Feb 2012, 11:03 am) *

The puppy training class I use teaches a "finish" from a "wait"

Put the dog in a "sit" using whichever hand signal you choose, I put my hand flat with palm facing up wards and flick my wrist upwards so my fingers end up pointing towards the sky. tell the dog to "wait" with the flat hand signal as Beaky described. Walk away, turn around to face the dog. Big open arms (like a starfish) shout the dog's name and say "come". Dog (theoretically) comes to you. Put the dog in a "sit" right in front of you, looking at you. Then say "finish". Dog walks round you on your right side, behind your back and ends up on your left hand side (the heel position). Put the dog in a *sit*.

Sounds long winded but it happens fast and looks beautiful when you get it right lol.gif

When I first start it goes....

put the dog in a sit, put the dog in a sit again, walk away, retrieve dog from wherever it's bogged off to. Put the dog in a sit. step away slowly so you're still only 3cm's away from the dog. Call the dog. retrieve the dog from wherever it's bogged off to. put the dog in a sit. Clip the dog's lead back on and get one of the teachers to stand behind gently holding the lead so dog can't bog off. Tip the wink to the teacher to say you're going to call the dog, call the dog, run round in a Benny Hill style whilst dog is hoovering up any treats it can find and you're trying desperately to grab trailing lead.....

rolleyes.gif maybe I should try a different breed to retrievers who can sniff out a dropped treat at 300 paces lol.gif



QUOTE(misty11 @ 22nd Feb 2012, 2:00 pm) *

What you described is called a novice recall. Then there is the 'A' recall which is when you call the dog to heel and carry on walking.

Sorry if you knew that already! but it's easier to say novice recall lol.gif

lol.gif lol.gif lol.gif
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misty11
post 22nd Feb 2012, 2:50 pm
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lol.gif
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